EVE Search - Never Deal With Thieves, Even Large Ones.

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Nials Noir	Posted - 2003.07.22 12:08:00 - [1] Hello,one of my previous characters was Commissar Gaunt and I have reached my wits end. I have made every attempt to end this matter in an amicable way, but I have been blocked at every turn by posturing fools. The thievs I speak of are no other than Taggart Transdimensional Inc, one of, if not the, largest corporations in EVE. Almost 3 months ago now, I invested with a BP venture fund which was suppost to pay monthly dividends and give continued updates via email. I posted this on the TTI general forum over a month ago now: "One of your members, a Mr Vexx Dmor, recently(1 month ago) began a BP and manufacture fund which was open for public investment. I invested 2 million(value of 2 shares) of my personnal funds and was informed by Mr Dmor that I would recive my investment back, plus a minimum of triple that sum in dividends. Until 10 days ago, communication was exellent. Emails were sent out to myself regarding the progress of the fund and its exact assets, then I recived this email on July 3rd of 2003: "Dividends will be calculated Tuesday of next week after the July 4th holiday weekend. Please send me an email if you intend to reinvest dividends or wish to receive a cash dispursement. Thank you and I hope everyone has a great weekend!!! Vexx" I sent an email back requesting that my dividends be calculated and my money refunded, as due to poor leadership in a corp I joined with Commissar Gaunt, he became unplayable(as I was told to attack several ships, all supposedly members of a corp my old corp were at war with, unfortunatly for me, I did not notice the lack of red bars next to the names until after the engagement, as they were also in powerful ships and it was quite quick, the result was a -8.6 sec rating) and so I chose to begin a new career with my old trader alt, making him my main char. This char will be forming a corp soon and needs the money I am owed to help fund this. I have deviated from the topic, I apologise. After the date on which this email was recived, I have sent 2 emails and numerous ingame messages, all to no avail as I have recived no money, or indeed communication of any kind from Mr Dmor after the aformentioned email. I decided to take a more active approach, and joined your IRC chatroom 2 days ago, asking to speak to someone about this matter. I forget the names of those I spoke to, but the first had no clue who Vexx Dmor was, the second however did know of him and of the venture. He was very helpful and reviewed the IRC logs, afterwards informing me there had been no sign of Vexx Dmor in the IRC for several days. I returned today and as no officals were available to speak with me, I was directed here. Now I can understand the fact that there may be important RL reasons for Mr Dmors continued absence from the game, however he is still a TTI employee, regardless of whether the venture was his alone, I would expect that TTI would police such things vigourously, to prevent any possible slight on TTI's name. I am here to make a simple request; give me my money, or give me an explenation as to why I cannot contact Mr Dmor. To you, such an amount of ISK will most likely seem like small change, but to me, it is a substantial amount of money and I dont think its unreasonable to ask you to account for your employees actions. I will refrain from posting anything on the official forums for the moment, but if I do not see some kind of willingness to communicate within 48 hours, I will post a complete log of all emails recived by me from Mr Dmor and request that other investors contact me ingame to form some kind of protest against this. As I said if there is a reasonable explenation as to why my money is not in my wallet, I will simply wait for it patiently, but I will not wait forever. Would whoever reads this please have someone senior, who also had detailed knowlage of this venture contact me at my email address; [email protected] or ingame on my new character Lelldorin. Thank you for what im sure will be a quick and helpful response" There have been 3 replies to that particular thread, one of which was even by the CEO Ragnar: "I have no idea what you are talking about. I don't have knowledge of all of my corp member's banking practices, but it is certainly EXTREMELY uncommon for our members to take investment money from outside of Taggart and normally they should only do so if it is a program that has been approved by Wyatt Financial. As DStroy said, we will look into this and find out. Every one of Taggart's financial operations is immensely successful, but I do not know this matter you are discussing." So dirst of all, he flat out denies the venture existing, which is untrue, then he claims it will be looked into. If it is being looked into, then why have I recived no emails or ingame mails from TTI of ANY KIND by now? Why have I been ignored totally on the 4 visits I have made to #Taggart, their IRC channel and why does the CEO of ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir Amarr Doomheim	Posted - 2003.07.22 12:08:00 - [2] Hello,one of my previous characters was Commissar Gaunt and I have reached my wits end. I have made every attempt to end this matter in an amicable way, but I have been blocked at every turn by posturing fools. The thievs I speak of are no other than Taggart Transdimensional Inc, one of, if not the, largest corporations in EVE. Almost 3 months ago now, I invested with a BP venture fund which was suppost to pay monthly dividends and give continued updates via email. I posted this on the TTI general forum over a month ago now: "One of your members, a Mr Vexx Dmor, recently(1 month ago) began a BP and manufacture fund which was open for public investment. I invested 2 million(value of 2 shares) of my personnal funds and was informed by Mr Dmor that I would recive my investment back, plus a minimum of triple that sum in dividends. Until 10 days ago, communication was exellent. Emails were sent out to myself regarding the progress of the fund and its exact assets, then I recived this email on July 3rd of 2003: "Dividends will be calculated Tuesday of next week after the July 4th holiday weekend. Please send me an email if you intend to reinvest dividends or wish to receive a cash dispursement. Thank you and I hope everyone has a great weekend!!! Vexx" I sent an email back requesting that my dividends be calculated and my money refunded, as due to poor leadership in a corp I joined with Commissar Gaunt, he became unplayable(as I was told to attack several ships, all supposedly members of a corp my old corp were at war with, unfortunatly for me, I did not notice the lack of red bars next to the names until after the engagement, as they were also in powerful ships and it was quite quick, the result was a -8.6 sec rating) and so I chose to begin a new career with my old trader alt, making him my main char. This char will be forming a corp soon and needs the money I am owed to help fund this. I have deviated from the topic, I apologise. After the date on which this email was recived, I have sent 2 emails and numerous ingame messages, all to no avail as I have recived no money, or indeed communication of any kind from Mr Dmor after the aformentioned email. I decided to take a more active approach, and joined your IRC chatroom 2 days ago, asking to speak to someone about this matter. I forget the names of those I spoke to, but the first had no clue who Vexx Dmor was, the second however did know of him and of the venture. He was very helpful and reviewed the IRC logs, afterwards informing me there had been no sign of Vexx Dmor in the IRC for several days. I returned today and as no officals were available to speak with me, I was directed here. Now I can understand the fact that there may be important RL reasons for Mr Dmors continued absence from the game, however he is still a TTI employee, regardless of whether the venture was his alone, I would expect that TTI would police such things vigourously, to prevent any possible slight on TTI's name. I am here to make a simple request; give me my money, or give me an explenation as to why I cannot contact Mr Dmor. To you, such an amount of ISK will most likely seem like small change, but to me, it is a substantial amount of money and I dont think its unreasonable to ask you to account for your employees actions. I will refrain from posting anything on the official forums for the moment, but if I do not see some kind of willingness to communicate within 48 hours, I will post a complete log of all emails recived by me from Mr Dmor and request that other investors contact me ingame to form some kind of protest against this. As I said if there is a reasonable explenation as to why my money is not in my wallet, I will simply wait for it patiently, but I will not wait forever. Would whoever reads this please have someone senior, who also had detailed knowlage of this venture contact me at my email address; [email protected] or ingame on my new character Lelldorin. Thank you for what im sure will be a quick and helpful response" There have been 3 replies to that particular thread, one of which was even by the CEO Ragnar: "I have no idea what you are talking about. I don't have knowledge of all of my corp member's banking practices, but it is certainly EXTREMELY uncommon for our members to take investment money from outside of Taggart and normally they should only do so if it is a program that has been approved by Wyatt Financial. As DStroy said, we will look into this and find out. Every one of Taggart's financial operations is immensely successful, but I do not know this matter you are discussing." So dirst of all, he flat out denies the venture existing, which is untrue, then he claims it will be looked into. If it is being looked into, then why have I recived no emails or ingame mails from TTI of ANY KIND by now? Why have I been ignored totally on the 4 visits I have made to #Taggart, their IRC channel and why does the CEO of ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir	Posted - 2003.07.22 12:10:00 - [3] why does the CEO of such a large corporation deny the existance of this venture when it has been admitted to me that this man WAS a member of TTI, he WAS known to be undertaking in this venture and that there ARE other investors all in the same boat as myself(I have been contacted by one via email). Regardless of whether or not this person was a scam artist within TTI, whether he has simply become too ill to get to a computer for severa;l months or whether TTI are simply thieves, I expect compensation. Seeing as attempting to get communication, LET ALONE money out of TTI is like drawing blood from a stone, I make this post. Not to whine, not to moan but to prevent others from making the same mistake I did, trusting these crooks with my money. TTI owe me by my reconing 2 and a half months of dividends, plus my origional stake of 2 miliion isk, a grand total of 17 million isk(guarenteed minimum return of 6 mil per month). To them this is pennies, to me it is a lot of money, so im hoping this post at the very least hurts their sales to that amount, or at the very least their reputation. ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir Amarr Doomheim	Posted - 2003.07.22 12:10:00 - [4] why does the CEO of such a large corporation deny the existance of this venture when it has been admitted to me that this man WAS a member of TTI, he WAS known to be undertaking in this venture and that there ARE other investors all in the same boat as myself(I have been contacted by one via email). Regardless of whether or not this person was a scam artist within TTI, whether he has simply become too ill to get to a computer for severa;l months or whether TTI are simply thieves, I expect compensation. Seeing as attempting to get communication, LET ALONE money out of TTI is like drawing blood from a stone, I make this post. Not to whine, not to moan but to prevent others from making the same mistake I did, trusting these crooks with my money. TTI owe me by my reconing 2 and a half months of dividends, plus my origional stake of 2 miliion isk, a grand total of 17 million isk(guarenteed minimum return of 6 mil per month). To them this is pennies, to me it is a lot of money, so im hoping this post at the very least hurts their sales to that amount, or at the very least their reputation. ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir	Posted - 2003.07.22 15:42:00 - [5] The point is not about RP, a TTI employee ran an investment fund. He assured me this was monitored by TTI. Other TTI employees admitted to me in IRC that the corp new about this venture. As I said, to you 2 mil is small, but its not 2 mil, its 2 mil plus 2 and a half months of dividends im due, thats 17 mil, not such a small amount. As far as RPing getting revenge, how can I do this when the person has not been heard of for 3 months? Hes not logged in, hes not sent emails, hes not been in the IRC. The point is, TTI should not have allowed him to run this venture if they thouht this would have happened. A corp is almost always held accountable if one of their members attacks someone, however they cannot be if one of their members pulls a scam? Thats rediculous IMO, to them this money is nothing so whyt not refund it, I iuse gaunts email address, I know things about the investment only people involved would know, I have several emails recived from Vexx's address before he stoped communicating, its not like I cant prove the link. Anyway I realsie these money grubbing gits will never give me any money, but I want this to be seen, dont do buisiness with TTI is all im saying, you will lose out in the end. ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir Amarr Doomheim	Posted - 2003.07.22 15:42:00 - [6] The point is not about RP, a TTI employee ran an investment fund. He assured me this was monitored by TTI. Other TTI employees admitted to me in IRC that the corp new about this venture. As I said, to you 2 mil is small, but its not 2 mil, its 2 mil plus 2 and a half months of dividends im due, thats 17 mil, not such a small amount. As far as RPing getting revenge, how can I do this when the person has not been heard of for 3 months? Hes not logged in, hes not sent emails, hes not been in the IRC. The point is, TTI should not have allowed him to run this venture if they thouht this would have happened. A corp is almost always held accountable if one of their members attacks someone, however they cannot be if one of their members pulls a scam? Thats rediculous IMO, to them this money is nothing so whyt not refund it, I iuse gaunts email address, I know things about the investment only people involved would know, I have several emails recived from Vexx's address before he stoped communicating, its not like I cant prove the link. Anyway I realsie these money grubbing gits will never give me any money, but I want this to be seen, dont do buisiness with TTI is all im saying, you will lose out in the end. ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir	Posted - 2003.07.22 20:45:00 - [7] "Intresting. Oh and could you by any chance explain how the CEOs statement "I have no idea what you are talking about. I don't have knowledge of all of my corp member's banking practices, but it is certainly EXTREMELY uncommon for our members to take investment money from outside of Taggart and normally they should only do so if it is a program that has been approved by Wyatt Financial. As DStroy said, we will look into this and find out." which to me sounds like "I run a 200+ person corp, I don't know what each member is doing, but we'll look into it.". You however aparently read that same line and decide it means that "he flat out denies the venture existing, which is untrue, then he claims it will be looked into." Now since my first language is german I might be misinterpreting the CEOs statement but "I don't have knowledge of all of my corp member's banking practices" to me atleast means that he's stating that he has no knowledge of the fund that you are refering to, not that "he flat out denies the venture existing" as you put it. That you then declare that TTI owes you money while you are basically **ing on them is also rather funny, I'm assuming you aren't expecting any money anymore. Wouldn't it be ironic if TTI decide that your whining is annoying enough that they put out a 17 million ISK bounty on your head because of the malicious attack on their brand by you, afterall it's just pennies as you said." Im sorry you feel that way, however, regardless of a corporations size, it is a CEOs responsibility of the high ranking officials to know what is going on, however I can understand how difficault this is when a corp approaches TTIs size. As to your "**ing on them" statement, are you honestly saying you would not be in the slightest buit annoyed that a member of such a large corp had taken off with a substancial portion of your money? If you could do that then you are a stronger person than most. Apparently it does pay to complain, as aparently Calladen has been assigned to look into this. There is only one problem I have with your post Ragnar. I do not see how this is in any way different from one of your members destroying another persons cruiser, one of your members actions directly resulted in myself and others losing assets, what form the assets take or how they are lost is irrelavent, and yet you will pay for this persons new ship. Anyway, the matter is supposedly being looked into, lets hope it takes less than a month to get back to me this time. ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir Amarr Doomheim	Posted - 2003.07.22 20:45:00 - [8] "Intresting. Oh and could you by any chance explain how the CEOs statement "I have no idea what you are talking about. I don't have knowledge of all of my corp member's banking practices, but it is certainly EXTREMELY uncommon for our members to take investment money from outside of Taggart and normally they should only do so if it is a program that has been approved by Wyatt Financial. As DStroy said, we will look into this and find out." which to me sounds like "I run a 200+ person corp, I don't know what each member is doing, but we'll look into it.". You however aparently read that same line and decide it means that "he flat out denies the venture existing, which is untrue, then he claims it will be looked into." Now since my first language is german I might be misinterpreting the CEOs statement but "I don't have knowledge of all of my corp member's banking practices" to me atleast means that he's stating that he has no knowledge of the fund that you are refering to, not that "he flat out denies the venture existing" as you put it. That you then declare that TTI owes you money while you are basically **ing on them is also rather funny, I'm assuming you aren't expecting any money anymore. Wouldn't it be ironic if TTI decide that your whining is annoying enough that they put out a 17 million ISK bounty on your head because of the malicious attack on their brand by you, afterall it's just pennies as you said." Im sorry you feel that way, however, regardless of a corporations size, it is a CEOs responsibility of the high ranking officials to know what is going on, however I can understand how difficault this is when a corp approaches TTIs size. As to your "**ing on them" statement, are you honestly saying you would not be in the slightest buit annoyed that a member of such a large corp had taken off with a substancial portion of your money? If you could do that then you are a stronger person than most. Apparently it does pay to complain, as aparently Calladen has been assigned to look into this. There is only one problem I have with your post Ragnar. I do not see how this is in any way different from one of your members destroying another persons cruiser, one of your members actions directly resulted in myself and others losing assets, what form the assets take or how they are lost is irrelavent, and yet you will pay for this persons new ship. Anyway, the matter is supposedly being looked into, lets hope it takes less than a month to get back to me this time. ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir	Posted - 2003.07.23 09:34:00 - [9] 1. Yes he bloody was in taggart, he WAS in it when he made a forum post, btw on that post in almost positive a couple o TTI members posted to say hes a good guy, you cab trust him, etc. 2. As I said, there were posts on the thgread syaing he was trustworthy, he had a taggart email address. If you had bothered to read my post, you would have noticed that, and also noticed that the reason that I am owed 17 mil is because by the terms of investemnt, I gave 2 mil and was to expect 6 mil per month, PLUS my 2 mil stake to reinvest, meaning that seeing as Ive not been payed the dividends from the CONTRACT me and vexx entered into(and if you could do simple maths you would realise this) 6+6+3+2=17. ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir Amarr Doomheim	Posted - 2003.07.23 09:34:00 - [10] 1. Yes he bloody was in taggart, he WAS in it when he made a forum post, btw on that post in almost positive a couple o TTI members posted to say hes a good guy, you cab trust him, etc. 2. As I said, there were posts on the thgread syaing he was trustworthy, he had a taggart email address. If you had bothered to read my post, you would have noticed that, and also noticed that the reason that I am owed 17 mil is because by the terms of investemnt, I gave 2 mil and was to expect 6 mil per month, PLUS my 2 mil stake to reinvest, meaning that seeing as Ive not been payed the dividends from the CONTRACT me and vexx entered into(and if you could do simple maths you would realise this) 6+6+3+2=17. ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir	Posted - 2003.07.23 13:20:00 - [11] In other words, you didnt think before you psted, I proved you wrong and you cant think of an intelligent reply, or what you said:no point arguing with someone resorts to slandering all the time. right.....sure... ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir Amarr Doomheim	Posted - 2003.07.23 13:20:00 - [12] In other words, you didnt think before you psted, I proved you wrong and you cant think of an intelligent reply, or what you said:no point arguing with someone resorts to slandering all the time. right.....sure... ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir	Posted - 2003.07.23 14:54:00 - [13] Thank you calladen. Jora: thats easy enough, in the past 2 and a half months, that money would have been invested in trade goods, which would thenn be sold at a profit, many times over. As I did not have that money to begin with, it took me a few weeks of mining my ass off to get enough money to get back into tradeing again, as I had to buy skills, ships, equipment etc for my new char, If I had had that money at the beginning, I would have far more than 17 mil in my wallet, as it stands I so far have less than 5 million isk. That is why I asked for the full amount owed, because if the money had been refunded as promised, I would not be in the position I am now, I would be able to buy ships for new members of my corp far more easily, I would be able to fly a cruiser in 0.0 space and mine good ores, hunt good pirates because I could afford to lose one, I would be able to invest in rare cargo expanders, overdrives, afterburners and other moduals making my trade runs even more profitable. You must see where im going with this. ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir Amarr Doomheim	Posted - 2003.07.23 14:54:00 - [14] Thank you calladen. Jora: thats easy enough, in the past 2 and a half months, that money would have been invested in trade goods, which would thenn be sold at a profit, many times over. As I did not have that money to begin with, it took me a few weeks of mining my ass off to get enough money to get back into tradeing again, as I had to buy skills, ships, equipment etc for my new char, If I had had that money at the beginning, I would have far more than 17 mil in my wallet, as it stands I so far have less than 5 million isk. That is why I asked for the full amount owed, because if the money had been refunded as promised, I would not be in the position I am now, I would be able to buy ships for new members of my corp far more easily, I would be able to fly a cruiser in 0.0 space and mine good ores, hunt good pirates because I could afford to lose one, I would be able to invest in rare cargo expanders, overdrives, afterburners and other moduals making my trade runs even more profitable. You must see where im going with this. ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir	Posted - 2003.07.24 00:19:00 - [15] Cheers sinzer, nice to know youve seen the error of your ways and become an honest citizen:P hehe ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."
Nials Noir Amarr Doomheim	Posted - 2003.07.24 00:19:00 - [16] Cheers sinzer, nice to know youve seen the error of your ways and become an honest citizen:P hehe ----------------------------------------------- "The clone is a wonderful creation, it pulled me back from the jaws of death and now I am reborn."

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